Category: Designers Working With
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On the last post, photographers answered the question, “As a professional designer, what are the main points you want clients (potential and present) to know before contacting you about a project?” Another way to learn how to work with photographers is to find out what not to do.
So, borrowing from what could potentially be a leap over hindsight, I asked the question, “When working with designers, what do you see as the top problem areas?”
Bill
No major problems! However, sometimes a designer or art director will say something like: “well, this will only take you half-a-day” — while I know it will take longer.
I’d prefer it if they’d just describe the job, and then ask me how long I think it will take to do. Designers’ time estimates sometimes fail to factor in such things as packing, loading, unloading, setting up, breaking down, repacking and reloading the lighting equipment — not to mention the time spend in digital post production.
I shoot all-digital — almost always RAW files. My rule of thumb is that the post-production time needed to perform digital processing and preliminary color correction and optimization of the pictures, and then produce digital contact sheets, or an on-line gallery for the client, plus a few samples of fully optimized images, will take me at least as long as the photo-shoot itself did.
Also . . . if the time and money required to produce a shoot a certain way is too much for the budget the designer has, it’s often possible to do the shoot a different way . . . for instance, without the big lights, and thus without the time and the assistant(s) that the big lights require.
Maybe, for instance, the job could be shot in a quick photojournalistic manner with no lights, or just with small battery powered lights bounced off a wall or a ceiling — this may create a somewhat different look and feeling than my the big lights do, but it can be extremely effective for certain projects.
All this should be discussed candidly, but one problem is that it’s often hard to find out what the designer’s true budget really is for the job.
Many times I will ask up-front, how much are you planning to allocate for all this photography, what is your budget? And the designer or art buyer will say, “Oh, we don’t have any budget number in mind, just give us an estimate.” Then I put together an estimate for them — which for a complex shoot may take me hours of work — and when I deliver the estimate, sometimes the reply is “Oh, that’s much more than our budget, which x dollars!” Well, only the day before, the designer told me they had no specific budget number in mind.
Of course, if you read and believe some books on negotiating, it’s smart to do that. According to some business gurus, the party who gives a price first in a negotiation is at a disadvantage — hence the coy little charade by the designer or art buyer.
But I think it’s dumb. I’d rather get at least a ballpark estimate or range from the designer or art buyer, so I can either craft an appropriate photographic approach that will do the job within their range, or tell them I can’t do the job that I believe they want within their range — and not waste my time on putting together a great proposal that will be out of their area of possibility.
I think being realistic and candid about the budget range is actually a smarter way for the designer to go. And it by no means precludes responsible negotiating. Indeed, it may result in a better result for the designer — and for their client.
Bill Wisser | Advertising and Editorial Photographer
Bill Wisser Photo.com | The Naked Eye
Bruce
Low level experience combined with the need to CYA can be tough on a photographer. This isn’t limited to designers nor is it limited to photographers. Experience helps give the designers the confidence to let go a measure of creative vision thus giving the photographer some room to breath and add greater value. I love them all but many of my best designer clients are very fastidious about the finest detail which can detract from the emotion of a photograph and can even add needless tension to the set.
Bruce DeBoer | Photographer
DeBoerWorks Photographic Productions
Damian Counsell
I’ve only ever worked for one designer—and he’s a friend who’s done me plenty of favours so I did the jobs for free. I imagine the most likely source of trouble would be if the client was unclear about his or her goals. It’s harder to score a bullseye if you don’t know where the target is.
Damian Counsell | Photographer
Sepial fine film photography | The Wedding Photography Blog
Dave
The single biggest issue is that fine art photography sites need to be changing all the time. Suppose that you are a great (but unknown) fine art photographer. You have say 50 wonderful images to display. Oh - make it a hundred. The typical potential buyer, assuming that they find your site somehow, will browse through images, and maybe email you, but they won’t buy anything at the time. They need a reason to return.
Generally this means that the website has to be changing in some way. If it means adding photographs, then the site has to make this easy for the photographer to do. But the biggest single issue is that the fine art photographer doesn’t have money for online advertising. And frankly, even if he/she does - online advertising doesn’t work well for fine art photography.
So that means you are reliant on the search engine for exposure. What follows is that the web designer should be totally conversant with how search engines work - esp. Google - and has to think twice for example when they are going to design the site in Flash. In other words, the very design of the site is related to how visible it will be.
So those are the biggest problems I see with designers: not having a site that is easily updateable by the photographer, and not being concerned enough with the sites’ search visibility.
Dave Beckerman | Photographer / Owner
Dave Beckerman Photography | Black and White Photography
Jeffrey
Not to drive this into the ground, but designers need to know what they want or don’t want. If a designer doesn’t know what they want that’s fine… really, it’s just they have to be honest about it. Clients call me all the time and not really know what they want but they know they like my creative result so I’m asked produce a similar result (or something new). Good communication is very important, it amazing how “creative communicators” often fail to communicate with each other. Some clients know what they want but have difficulty explaining their ideas or their client’s ideas. I might add if I don’t understand your needs it is up to me to tell you and be sure I understand your needs before I accept the project. Communication is a two way street.
Jeffrey Jacobs | Photographer / President
Jeffrey Jacobs Photography Inc.
Jon
Copyright & licensing:
Designers who don’t want to understand the way professional photographers charge. Many a time a call has ended with “that includes the copyright doesn’t it”? I’m afraid it doesn’t! It’s equally as important for designers to protect the intellectual property rights in their designs as it is for photographers to protect the intellectual property rights in their images. I have met many young (and old!) designers who routinely throw copyright in for free with their designs which is quite unbelievable.
Selling the copyright to your designs or images is a bad business decision. Even if (what may appear at the time to be) a large amount of money is offered for your copyright you have no way of knowing what uses your work will be put to, or how valuable your work really is to the client. What may appear to you as a major payday now could be folly in years to come if your logo or image is reused worldwide in prolific ad campaigns or becomes the “signature logo/image” for your client’s business. This is why licencing your work is best - you get usage fees based upon the use of your work.
If someone is offering you $$$ for your copyright then it figures that it must be valuable to your client have that copyright! So by retaining your copyright and licencing your work - if your logo/image goes big time then you will get royalties proportionate to its use rather than a lump sum up front that may equate to a couple of years use only. Good at the time but 10 years down the line when you’re getting no revenue but seeing your work everywhere will you feel it was a good deal?
Jon Boyes | Advertising and Editorial Photographer
Jon Boyes
Patrick
Designers/clients who do not take the time to give final approval of an important large image before the set has been struck and upon reviewing the image at a later date decide they would like to make adjustments. Although the designer cannot always be available during the shoot, they should make time for approval via jpeg emails or other means. Reshoots for minor adjustments are demoralizing, a waste time and cost money.
Designer/clients often expect electronic post processing and/or color correcting to be done at no charge, when in fact, these processes take additional time, expertise, and should be charged accordingly. In the old days of film, this work was farmed out to film strippers and film retouchers and was invoiced separately.
Patrick Chuprina | Photographer
Chuprina Studios
Rochelle
Designers need to provide adequate direction as to the photography that they are looking for. I would really discourage photographers from agreeing to do a lengthy photo shoot without any guidelines, because none of those images could end up being used, causing a re-shoot, more cost and delays. Plus, the frustration is not usually conducive to creative thought!
Rochelle Dahl | Photographer & Designer
Rochelle Dahl Designs
Tom
Be sure to talk to the photographer about the intent/purpose of the project and allow them a chance to offer their experience on what they can bring to the project. We all (designers included) grit our teeth at those clients who want to have complete and total control over project and micromanage the process. Make sure all the decision makers are involved early in the project and everyone is working towards the same goal.
Tom Smalling | Photographer
Tom Smalling Photography & Design | Tom Smalling’s Photography Blog
Will
Lack of focus on one problem at a time, some designers will bounce between projects and problems. While multi-tasking is essential, having a predefined work flow can make a project run smoother.
Will Williams | Photographer and Designer
Perspective-Images.com
Next up is question three where I asked our photographers, “How do you work?” When writer Tom Chandler was asked the same question, he gave the honest answer, “Some days more slowly than others.” Yeah, I sure can relate.
until the next
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